I just found this related article on LA Weekly http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/crime/family-of-barbara-ware-victim/
4: Barbara Ware
#32 (Jen). It was interesting to hear your comments... I always wondered why the surviving victim did not comment on her thoughts and if it could be the GS on that call (assuming that she did not think so, thus no comments made about it). Just maybe the cops had the positive ID from the surviving victim, but did not want to say so...hoping to have another person ID him. Anyhow...your comment from someone who knew him and his voice is the first I have heard to confirm it. I still have my doubts that it was him for logical reasons. If it was him, then wow, he was sneakier that I thought he was. I hope others than know the GS voice will comment to confirm, or I hope the surviving victim would comment on this part. Thanks again Jen.
i believe the victims and there famlies should be more important than that of serial killers themselves... the news plasters these demons all over the news and shows there pictures and tells a bit of there stories , I think the victims families deserve recognition for the tragedies they have sustained by these people who tear there hearts out by taking there loved ones away from them forever.... stop putting pasting these serial killers pictures everywhere and remind people that this a very real and sorrowful event for every family whos dealt with these types of criminals ...everyone remembers bundy, ed gien, jack the ripper, gary ridgeway,etc.. who remembers the names of the victims other than the family members and the investigators in each crime??? the weird thing is i lived in bellingham washington and bought books frim ted bundy in the seventies when he lived there.... i lived one block from figuroa when bianci and his partner were killing in the seventies in L.A , i was living in Kent washington right behind green river road when gary ridgeway was on his killing spree and i was living in L.A. and O.C california when ramirez was on his killing spree in the eighties... and its very personal to me with these kinds of criminals because i coulve been one of these victims at any given time... I thank GOD im not... My heart , love and prayers to all the family members whove lost loved ones i will pray for you all.....
I feels sick to my stomach, this guy was my neighbor and was the nices man. I came in contact with him many times!!!!!!! After listening to the 911 call it was HIM!!!!!!!!!!!! he called himself to throw the police off. He is sick. His signiture line was Bye-Bye!!!!!! i was convinced that was him.
Whenever I read blogs coming from 'mini detectives', I know that most people do not have a clue as to how false allegations can destroy lives; of the accused and their loved ones. I lived this nightmare 20 years ago when my cousin, Det. Rickey Ross was accused of murdering these women. I watched him being locked up for months, suffering humiliation, with an emotional and physical toll it took on his life before we buried him on his 55th birthday in 2003. The thanks my cousin got for 20 years of service to the Sheriff's department and the LAPD was outrageous!! Even after the ballistics could not be linked to him, then Chief Darryl Gates declared that he was still 'watching' him. We had to deal with the embarrasment in Rialto as people pointed and starred declaring him the 'killer.' It is interesting how quiet exhonerations can be only after a very loud and condemning accusation has occured on CNN and the LA Times. Our family will never forget what Los Angeles Law enforcement did to my cousin, Det. Rickey Ross, a top cop and a dignified man.
In the 911 call, the informant states that the only thing he could see was feet. Yet he repeatedly calls the body a "she." How did he know that unless he was involved or went and took a closer look? I think it was the killer.
jay: in one of the articles i read about this case, the police reportedly said that other neighbors (besides the anonymous caller) also said they saw the van and someone disposing of the body. if there's more than one person reporting this, it's safe to say the van WAS in the alley and WAS being used by GS (before returning it to the church). that said, i was not able to corroborate that news report with any other articles saying the same thing (mentioning neighbors). i would think the LAPD knows though (whether there was more than one person reporting it). they sure seem to think the van was used by GS, based on what i have read thus far.
the caller doesn't have an accent (the sole survivor said he had a Caribbean accent), so for that reason alone, i do not think it was the GS. the GS never reported any of his previous murders to the police, and i seriously doubt he did this one. the anonymous caller is someone who probably lives in that area, saw what happened, and for whatever reason does not want to get involved. that's perfectly reasonable. he's just protecting himself.
Additions: Forgot to add that the caller does not want his name known since he lives on the streets and does not want to be labeled as a narc. You must remember this was when crack/cocaine abuse was at its peak in LA and the caller is also probably a user. He knows too many people because of this reason and he also doesn't want to end up dead...
I honestly don't think the caller was the killer. The caller's voice is definitely that of a black male in his early 40s to early 50s. He also sounds slightly intoxicated (probably the reason he's calm). I'd also agree with whoever said he's probably a vet, he lives on the street and was camping on the side of a road/alley and in very close proximity to the killer when the dump occurred, but not close enough to see his face. I'm assuming this happened at night and that's why he was not able to catch a glimpse of the killers face, though the license plate had lights making the plate visible. The killer knew he'd been spotted and quickly returned the van to the church and that's the reason he jumped the curb and parked so close to the building, then he jumped out and likely took off on a bicycle that he had planted in the bushes nearby...
more good info found here on Barbra http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/thedailymirror/2009/03/grim-sleeper-re.html#comment-captcha I agree with carbuff in #24.. maybe by turning in the van details, 911 caller thinks cops can catch him from here...? or maybe just a local who can't get more involved for personal reasons, but has to do something...thus the call. Wonder if he got the licence plate from following the van back to the Chruch in his own car, Killer was in a rush to drop it back off or thought he was followed... and thus the bad parking job (against the wall). Caller may not have had better view of face as he was far off...came back later to confirm both the body and the van's Licence Plate..thus the 30 min. delay. My guess is that caller is NOT the killer...and that just maybe 911 caller was member of the church and why he noticed the van! OR caller lived in house very close to dump spot (within 4 houses on either side). I would think it would be hard to drive van down that alley if trash like gas tanks were in there...making noise to drive down it. I bet trash was already there, but IF not makes an interesting link that Pimped out Pinto and custom interior of orange car..maybe GS killer was a car guy? Plastic used in paint shop...gas tank was trash from body shop...maybe a smooth talking salesman for the shop... even had his own car done there...had access to other cars, even the church van from a faimily member or friend? Used the church van to dump bodies with as it was easy to dump bodies from (anything is better than a pinto) and if traced would come back to a churuch to avoid suspicion or be hard to trace to him/anyone.
The biggest argument against the 911 caller being the murderer is that it only happens once. Granted that this guy doesn't appear to be ritualistic, it's still a big break in his pattern. The caller doesn't sound arrogant, necessarily. Confident, yes, and maybe a little annoyed with the dispatcher for having trouble with the spelling, but not out of line. I'm picturing a middle-aged Vietnam vet or somebody like that -- he's seen bad stuff, so a murder isn't going to really rattle him. He knows what he saw, stayed calm and noted what was important, then went to find a phone. He's just getting a job done. But you're right, there is a certain amused smugness in a couple of places, like he knows (or thinks he knows) who he just turned in and is pleased about it.
I also believe that the caller on the 911 tape is in fact the "Sleeper". He seems to relaxed, and with too much accurate detail. All cops know that eyewitnesses give flimsy details. But every word that caller reported was 100% accurate. Also, does anyone else detect an arrogant/confident tone in the caller's voice? Usually, tips are reported by a nervous individual, the site of a body and a murderer will do that to some. The caller was too calm, almost happy. He was patient with dispatch, but you could tell that he felt she was below his payrate. If this caller is not him, then this person knows more than he let on. I think it's him.
I don't think this guy was in prison during the gaps in the murders. The 12 or 13 year gap, in my opinion is not really existent. I believe he may have committed more than a few murders during this time. The evidence in those cases may have been off, or the bodies have never been found. It is plausible that he may have moved to avoid capture. If you're arrested, the first thing they do is take your finger prints. In all of the cases connected with the "Grim Sleeper", prints were found, but never matched on any database. Hence, no prison. I've been looking at the BTK killer, to match gaps. It's my belief, that Sleeper may be married, or in a long relationship. Similar to BTK, one of the reasons for the gap was that he was married. It made him extra careful. There are some similarities between the two cases.
The reason GS called 9-1-1 to report his crime basically is b/c the body was dumped way out of the range of the others.
The Steele murder shook up the killer. Its a full year before he strikes again. The heat has subsided hes feeling confident, commits the crime and is brazen enough to call 911... if A BIG IF the van checks out clean.
Sunshine, you say that Barbara Ware was / is you cousin. Please accept my sincerest condolances for her death. I have made several attempts to find a suitable location from which the GS might be working. All places put your cousin way outside of any box containing all the other murders. This guy went way out of his way to get to her. Why? What made her special? Was she picked up somewhere within the same area as the rest and dumped out there? If so why? Why go so far to dump her? The caller has to be the GS. He took her a safe distance from the others, dumped her and then called 911. He is taunting the police. He isn't going anywhere. He has made this into a game. He may have even been there when they were processing her body, as a bystander. Just something to think about.
After reading what alot of people have wrote on this site I now think that caller was the GS. I mean what person would be that calm, and collective after seeing a woman dumped like she was nuthing. Then at the end of the conversation he giggles when asked "what's you're name". I do know in the 80's they could trace a call so it's weird they could not pin point the location of the call. Would have told alot of what he could actually have seen from where he was calling. This guy is so sloppy with his victims it's crazy this coward has not been caught.
Comment by WonderWall in comment #7: The gap of 1/2 hour in time is easily understood. If the tipster was a homeless man sleeping in the alley, he correctly would NOT have come out of his hiding place while he thought the killer was still nearby. Anybody in his position would have waited to ensure that the killer had left. Then, he would have had to walk to the nearest payphone location and maybe had to locate a payphone. 30 minutes from the time he supposedly witnessed the event to the time he called is reasonable time frame. Or, the caller was a property homeowner or renter watching from over the back fence and he did the same thing. Waited to ensure the killer was gone. Then, walked to a pay phone to either avoid a trace by LAPD or because he didn't own a phone.*** *** I know it seems odd that someone might not have a phone in their house back in the 1980's, but I actually met a lady in that situation. She hadn't paid her bills so they disconnected her phone. She had NO phone to use in her house (and that was before cell phones came about). The one thing that might be throwing everyone off is that the survivor described the killer as being much younger than the caller. But what if the survivor was incorrect in her assumption of his age? THEN, the caller might be the killer.
Jay said in comment #9: Van was observed by killer & used to confound police. I would agree. But I haven't seen anything here on this site that explained what exactly was told to the police by the Church members. Did the Church members have ANY idea of who used the van? How did the killer get the keys to the van? How did the killer return the van to the Church without being noticed by the members? Did the police obtain his prints, which they do have, from that van or some other source? I'm not clear from this site how the van episode was included in this murder other than being described in the 'tipster' phone call. If the only connection is the 'tipster' phone call, then the van may have just been used as a confusion tactic by the killer doing as you said, just observing it & calling in as if it were part of the crime. BUT again, the caller was older by at least ten or more years than the killer was described by the lone survivor.
In the photos of the victim determined to be Barbara Ware, how was she sexually assaulted? She is fully clothed and wearing sweats, not a dress or skirt. It is interesting if the grim sleeper sexually assaulted her and then pulled her pants back up.
Comment # 6 by "Just a Thought" : You need to get real. The investigation wasn't "pushed under the rug." It was ongoing but kept confidential to keep the killer from discovering that he was being smoked out. It would have made little difference if the LAPD had gone public when they realized there was a serial killer involved. Its public now and it isn't any different. In fact, the very thing the LAPD wanted to avoid has now happened. The killer knows he is being tracked and that the police have his fingerprints and DNA. Do you think the killer will remain in CA ? Probably not. He'll leave the area if he can. THAT is what the LAPD wanted to avoid by being secret. They didn't want him escaping before they discovered his identity. Now, he probably will be killing in some other City and the police there won't know right away that he is there. In short, there was a very good reason to not alert the killer & cause him to go into hiding. Furthermore, the LAPD didn't realize right away that among ALL THE MURDERS THAT HAPPEN IN THAT AREA, a few were killed by one killer. Before you loosely accuse the LAPD of "sweeping the investigation under the rug," you ought to seriously think about the benefits of catching the killer before he could leave the area.
well the grim is out there n still in the same car ii saw hIIM twice but n0T knowing HE was a killer ii saw hIIM n 0ct of 08 it was like 2 am n ME n mY friend was walking n HE was like DO u want a ride n we was lke we g00d so HE hooped out the car saying This spooky town so we was like WTF s0 g00d thing it was another man out HE said leave them girls ALONE s0 HE left n ii saw hIIM aGaIn on king n western n HE didn't NO WhO ii was n ask aGaIn ii said that's ok HE said ii kill hoes for fun but your a cutie pie ii want DO that n HE try to give ME his number after that den ii was watching amw the next day n den LOOK on google n that was the same car
He dumps the victim and then casually chooses a vehicle and driver to attach blame. He sees the blue and white Dodge van and follows it until it pulls into the parking lot of 6075 South Normandie Avenue. This would take perhaps 15 minutes. He notes the license plate and drives back to the dump location where he makes the 911 call. This senario could account for the 30 minute time delay, the accuracy of the callers information, his calm demeanor, the reason for the Dodge van’s hood still being warm and the seemingly lack of evidence collected from the Dodge van crime scene investigation (or lack thereof). When the people inside the church were interviewed by officers they admitted they had used the van earlier in the evening. If they had used the van then indeed the hood would be warm. Perhaps it was these innocent people the Grim Sleeper tailed and ‘framed’ in order to throw the investigation?
What caliber gun was used in Janecia Peters killing? It seems like he went dormant after the failed killing and when he resurfaced in early 2000 he didn’t have a gun, resorting to strangulation on a weaker and more vulnerable person (14 year old). By reading all the given facts it’s my guess he was recently released from prison (or in and out of prison) keep in mind the 13 year gap. He was not sentenced in L.A. county. He fled the L.A. area (he felt he failed and ‘Jackie’ would identify him) and was probably arrested in another jurisdiction/county for a violent crime (back then in the 80s, there was no DNA database). Upon his release, he had to have paroled to the only place he knew, HOME. Look for continuing parole violations involving drugs and the parolee eventually in and out of prison so much they finally said time served. This guy is a drug addict/ex-drug addict, he is involved in church and uses that clean cut persona to charm his victims, has trouble interacting sexually with women brought on by insecurities and rejection. He is the quite and smooth type. He obviously feels very confertable in the L.A. area, dumping these women within the dark alleys that he so often rode his bike through when he was a child. He isn’t as slick as everyone thinks and does not go on the prowl but acts more on instinct and urge after a drug induced frenzy. He doesn’t crave the attention but is rather annoyed that he’s on the radar. He will and has changed his MO a bit but he will always slip up due to is instinctive impulses (saliva on breast, semen. etc…). I really would like to know ALOT more about Thomas Steele’s murder. I believe that is the link!!!!!
I believe the Anonymous caller was the killer. If you saw a body being dumped would it take you a half hour to call the police?? No you would call right away from the nearest phone possible. This killer likes to play head games. He is toying with the police. The Anonymous caller seemed so calm to have just witnessed something like that.
Usually when a violent killer is inactive for years & then starts again........he has been in prison.This case has been bungle from the get go.Since they now know who they want, I hope they have checked that.It's pathetic these families found out from the press.Sounds like they need to clean house.Somebody work on it.These families deserve justice.Not only by catching this guy but by getting rid of the reasons this has been such a pushed under the rug story.People died because the law felt nobody had the right to know.All who made that decision need to be unemployeed.So sorry for your loss Sunshine.
Thank you Justin, I too feel the person that called 911 may be involved in some way... how was he able to give such details. Barbara Ware (was) is my cousin. She left behind a daughter and a host of family that loved and miss her.
I am so sad about this story. Ever since I was a kid,I heard a few stories. But not all. I didn't know she had a daughter. :(
I'm (personally) convinced that the man who called 911 and led the police to the Barbara Ware crime scene IS the Grim Sleeper himself. If you listen closely to the call you will notice that he sounds cool, calm and collected (as opposed to nervous or agitated) AND he starts chuckling when he tells the 911 operator that he's remaining anonymous because he knows too many people. I'm also pretty sure that the alley in which the body was dumped had to be very dark--so how could the caller have given out the van's license plate number correctly and the other information were he not somehow involved? Given that most of the victims' bodies were found in such close proximity to churches it's entirely possible that this maniac may consider himself an "avenging angel" who's attempting to "clean up" the streets of what he considers human "trash". Let's just hope and pray that he DOES get caught so that the victims can finally rest in peace and their families get some justice.
That's also circumstantial. Just because somebody saw the van dump it doesn't mean that it was that van.
i believe there was a blue and white van spotted dumping the body, i just saw a report on the news that stated that a witness reported seeing a blue and white van leaving the seen where the body was left. The van was found in a near by parking lot, the engine was still warm.